Ontario Tax Sale Property Forum
Tax Sale Forum => General => Topic started by: raylak on August 18, 2016, 08:40:44 PM
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So although I can extract most of the information one way or the other on the internet regarding tax sales, is there anyone here that subscribes to Ontario tax sales.ca website? If so, what level and what are your top reasons for it?
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So although I can extract most of the information one way or the other on the internet regarding tax sales, is there anyone here that subscribes to Ontario tax sales.ca website? If so, what level and what are your top reasons for it?
Ontario Tax Sales are one of 3 regular services I use (and pay for). The other two are Tri-Target and this site. Each has their advantages and disadvantages in a specific tax sale situation. Why; because this activity can be a very high risk business and in my personal opinion the risks are increasing for reasons of which I am not prepared to say in public at this time. (Why because we are all competitors and I consider it part of my competitive advantage).
In specific situations I use several other advisors / services which can and do cost me collectively a lot of money. If you want you can spend several thousand dollars to take a course on this business.
As each of us here is a unique case It is hard for me to comment whether other people will find the same value I do. The devil is in the details. Let us look at a couple of specific example instances; one of which involves you and one tax sale that happened yesterday.
Ray: The question you have to answer is do you want your Alberta Ranch and more specifically where are you going to hunt for tax sales.
If you are going to specialize in Alberta/B.C. I would not recommend Tri Target / Ontario Tax Sales because they specialize in Ontario. (Why pay for a Territorial hunting liscence if you do not hunt in the territory.) On the other hand Rob posts a lot of information about Alberta.
Lets look at Hastings Highlands tax sale of Yesterday; specifically Paradise Landing Maynooth. Waterfront with a cottage in poor repair. Referring to the Ontario Tax Sales results; 28 bids with a winning bid of $92,000. I did not bid it because I am too busy and I screwed up because I was too smart for my own good. :'(
Now I ask every reader a question: What was one key issue that separated winning bids from losing bids?
The answer is the line; Water Access Only but one of the pictures has a car ???
This obviously requires some on site work. Yours truly looked at another piece of information; mortgage from a financial institution and said to himself like a fool "Ah it will redeem." >:( Obviously in this case not very smart.) No wonder I am getting squished like a bug lately.
If there truly is road access and the cottage is repairable the winning bid maybe not that bad a price.
For me personally if I keep making mistakes like that and Mountain Man will be boosting this fall how he buried me. I can see the poetry starting now
"I put Dave in his grave."
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Hi Dave! As always you've been very very detailed in your response and this is knowledge that one just can't gain overnight. I seriously respect the mentorship here! You're truly guiding a lot of people and saving them from losing their shirt if they take your advise seriously. Homework is everything in this business!
On another note, just like how one can share Netflix, is it possible to split costs with someone for websites like Ontariotaxsales.ca? The cost of $350 seems a little steep for me at the moment so if there is someone out there wanting to split the costs, please message me here and we can talk about this :)
And, Rob - waiting to hear from you on your alberta expertise :) Definitely owe Dave2 a drink now for all his responses!
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Raylak,
There is a lot of hidden value in the Alberta properties at the moment and but it's a buy/hold strategy in my opinion. The other thing to consider is how the bidding is setup compared to Ontario. You are generally required to be in person, so that makes the list of buyers smaller and creates more value but also involves more work/time.
Let us know how your journey is going. The best advice when starting is to start looking at properties around your area first. Understanding the area is a big advantage. Being able to see the property can be extremely helpful.
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Hi Dave! As always you've been very very detailed in your response and this is knowledge that one just can't gain overnight. I seriously respect the mentorship here! You're truly guiding a lot of people and saving them from losing their shirt if they take your advise seriously. Homework is everything in this business!
On another note, just like how one can share Netflix, is it possible to split costs with someone for websites like Ontariotaxsales.ca? The cost of $350 seems a little steep for me at the moment so if there is someone out there wanting to split the costs, please message me here and we can talk about this :)
And, Rob - waiting to hear from you on your alberta expertise :) Definitely owe Dave2 a drink now for all his responses!
Ray:
All I can say is be careful about abusing copy writed material. Everyone wants to get something for free but Tri Target and OTS
have their expenses as well. Being pennywise and pound foolish is dangerous in this business. OTS and Tri Target charge differently for their services. One is better suited for low volume users and one for high volume is all I will say.
To do a bid costs me on average around $250 excluding any travel costs. My last car repairs cost me $2,500 to replace all my shocks etc.
and the branch my mechanic pulled between my brake line and my car body, could have left me stranded out in the middle of nowhere.
Recognize it is also a humbling business. I am supposed to know something but there were almost 30 people who were smarter then me up
in Paradise Landing, Maynooth. The in private suggestions I got about it were even more brutal; what Mountain Man was going to say if he won it. The best opening was from someone who goes by the moniker "Net----"
"I had a hoot.
Won all the loot,
and gave Dave the Boot"
I have spent over $1,000 on research for an individual property that I walked away from that the tax sale winner spent $500,000 on. Why because it was a former garbage dump near a water course.
Don't believe me; take a look at Hastings Highlands tax sale again; specifically the former minesite on McDonald Mine Road. The winning bidder may have an interesting opportunity or something else.
From Enroute Magazine:
http://enroute.aircanada.com/en/articles/getaway-to-bancroft Hunting for Gems in Ontarios Highlands
or:
http://www.bancroftdistrict.com/gemboree.php
Alternatively: From Canadian Family Physician http://www.cfp.ca/content/59/5/469
"Near Bancroft and Haliburton in Ontario, approximately 5 million tonnes of uranium mine tailings were left in jurisdictional limbo when uranium became a federal concern in 1977.17 Only through relentless prompting by citizens? groups has some of this remedial work begun. For older mines, neither governments nor companies have set aside sufficient funds for long-term management"[/b]
Was this a hold em or fold em one: Only two bidders; and sold for only $14,000
Certainly someone got it for the right price.
Could be the tax sale opportunity of the year or something much worse.
One only hopes the winning bidder did their homework.
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Rob,
Thank you for that advise. Currently, I'm in Ontario but I have been following Alberta for the last month and a half and yes, you are right, I would have to be there to participate. Not sure how realistic it is for me given that I have a "job" here and won't get a lot of time off to wander around Canada. That being said, I'd love to go for the BC annual auctions happening in September. Will you participate?
So far, I've participated in 4 tax sales and failed in all. I'm actually happy that I did not get any as the price points for which they did go, didn't make sense from a "deal" perspective. So, yes, keep trying! One thing I've learnt is that I probably will have very minimal to no luck in vastly populated areas so travelling far is probably smarter move but some towns and municipalities have such low population that it is very discouraging from a "growth" perspective. What are your thoughts on that?
DAVE!
You're right, I'm being cheap! Sometimes, I just feel I don't have enough faith in the whole system and I'm a little too worried about what the outcome will be. I see that you're spending $250 per deal which is crazy but makes a lot of sense. I do need to get to that stage. What advise would you give to reach to that level where I have confidence enough to spend that kind of money? I am very scared of losing my shirt in the process. But, then again if i don't spend, I might lose it anyways. It's a chicken and the egg problem.
- Ray
Raylak,
There is a lot of hidden value in the Alberta properties at the moment and but it's a buy/hold strategy in my opinion. The other thing to consider is how the bidding is setup compared to Ontario. You are generally required to be in person, so that makes the list of buyers smaller and creates more value but also involves more work/time.
Let us know how your journey is going. The best advice when starting is to start looking at properties around your area first. Understanding the area is a big advantage. Being able to see the property can be extremely helpful.
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DAVE!
You're right, I'm being cheap! Sometimes, I just feel I don't have enough faith in the whole system and I'm a little too worried about what the outcome will be. I see that you're spending $250 per deal which is crazy but makes a lot of sense. I do need to get to that stage. What advise would you give to reach to that level where I have confidence enough to spend that kind of money? I am very scared of losing my shirt in the process. But, then again if i don't spend, I might lose it anyways. It's a chicken and the egg problem. - Ray
Ray:
Its a lot worse then that because I am spending $250 PER BID. You don't want to know my (very lousy currently) batting average but true comments this spring and summer; about getting squished like a bug will give you a good idea.
Recognize now we are in an unusual market. There are two groups of people on this website right now.
a) The people who bought property in the past and if trying to sell it if they did a good buy they are having a ball with all the buyers.
b) People including yours truly trying to buy property(my inventory holdings if any, are not a topic for the public domain,) who are getting very frustrated.
c) Point b is doubly frustrating now because we are getting more redemptions caused by the booming real estate market.
because of the high prices.
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So i bit the bullet finally and bought the membership with OTS. Had a few exchanges with the other Dave! Very knowledgeable guy and speaks highly of you! Just saying.. Thanks for that push Dave2
DAVE!
You're right, I'm being cheap! Sometimes, I just feel I don't have enough faith in the whole system and I'm a little too worried about what the outcome will be. I see that you're spending $250 per deal which is crazy but makes a lot of sense. I do need to get to that stage. What advise would you give to reach to that level where I have confidence enough to spend that kind of money? I am very scared of losing my shirt in the process. But, then again if i don't spend, I might lose it anyways. It's a chicken and the egg problem. - Ray
Ray:
Its a lot worse then that because I am spending $250 PER BID. You don't want to know my (very lousy currently) batting average but true comments this spring and summer; about getting squished like a bug will give you a good idea.
Recognize now we are in an unusual market. There are two groups of people on this website right now.
a) The people who bought property in the past and if trying to sell it if they did a good buy they are having a ball with all the buyers.
b) People including yours truly trying to buy property(my inventory holdings if any, are not a topic for the public domain,) who are getting very frustrated.
c) Point b is doubly frustrating now because we are getting more redemptions caused by the booming real estate market.
because of the high prices.