Ontario Tax Sale Property Forum
Sheriff Sales / Foreclosures => General Discussion => Topic started by: Dave2 on July 19, 2011, 02:48:06 PM
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With a quiet board I have wondered what everyone has been doing. Got some evidence from this mornings Star. (see below) This guy 8) must have been out scouting properties and his pet gator needed a swim.
I was thinking i would like to borrow the gator for a few weeks next time I find a nice waterfront property and let him swim around it prior to the sale. might even lessen the competition ;D
In the interim I was thinking of augmenting my reserves (see photo) which are located close to where Frank was letting Rocco have a swim. It even helps that you can go to church at the same time.
http://www.churchkeybrewing.com/
[b]Is there an alligator in this Ontario creek?
2011/07/19 07:46:00 EmailPrint
Rss ArticleThe Canadian Press
STIRLING, ONT.?An eastern Ontario police chief is warning area residents to be cautious when dipping their toes in a local creek.
Police in Stirling-Rawdon, northwest of Belleville, have released a photo of what appears to be a small alligator in the mill pond.
The blurry photo was taken Friday and posted on Facebook.
Chief Brian Foley says the public should use caution around the pond until the animal is removed or the photo proven false.
The Ministry of Natural Resources is investigating.
Anyone spotting the reptile is urged to call police or the provincial ministry[/b]
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Hopefully they don't shoot Rocco. I'd like him back in one piece...he's gonna make a nice purse for my wife some day.
8)
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Hopefully they don't shoot Rocco. I'd like him back in one piece...he's gonna make a nice purse for my wife some day.
8)
Okay I will lay off the wise cracks about gators. But I will finalize with an observation that unlike gators big sharks make no sounds when they are feeding.
For those of you wondering how Rocco looks before he becomes a pair of shoes look below
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Pretty sure that was Rocco's uncle Tom. I believe that he was found on a beach in Rice Lake, stay out of the water Dave. 8)
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Pretty sure that was Rocco's uncle Tom. I believe that he was found on a beach in Rice Lake, stay out of the water Dave. 8)
Frank:
Not all of us have your smartness and skill. I am the first to recognize that. To prove it I though I would show a picture of you swimming with "uncle tom". But I think we do need to get back to business otherwise Rob will get disapointed.
I am going to throw a bone to the board. "Discussion with a treasurer at 4.30 this afternoon. (true storey) Initials M. C. (sorry but I don't give away everything). Words to the effect "he/she is going to wait until just before the bids are open to redeem" Occupied dwelling.
I am almost forced to bid which I will, if not total garbage; which I am honour bound to inform the board.
Do you take a chance or not? ???
That is what this game is all about?
BTW for those that are wondering what has happened to PFM, I believe this photo says it all
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Pretty sure that was Rocco's uncle Tom. I believe that he was found on a beach in Rice Lake, stay out of the water Dave. 8)
I am going to throw a bone to the board. "Discussion with a treasurer at 4.30 this afternoon. (true storey) Initials M. C. (sorry but I don't give away everything). Words to the effect "he/she is going to wait until just before the bids are open to redeem" Occupied dwelling.
Cramahe!!!
It will redeem. Stop the suspense. Save your money. Well looked after amd occupied property.
The municipality posted the notice of sale on the property to shame the owners into paying. Scumball municipality!!! Even landlords can't do this any longer but this municipality thinks that this is acceptable.
I am willing to give 12 to 1 odds here (on beer only) that this property will redeem.
Any takers Dave? We can get even pretty quick if I'm wrong. ;D
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Cramahe!!!
It will redeem. Stop the suspense. Save your money. Well looked after amd occupied property.
The municipality posted the notice of sale on the property to shame the owners into paying. Scumball municipality!!! Even landlords can't do this any longer but this municipality thinks that this is acceptable.
I am willing to give 12 to 1 odds here (on beer only) that this property will redeem.
Any takers Dave? We can get even pretty quick if I'm wrong. ;D
With that type of shift I don't know if I can calculate the true odds. Normally you want it 12:1 in your favour, now you are offering 12 to one odds IN MY FAVOUR; you must be VERY confident.
Against that type of shift the only way I will bet if the following conditions are met.
1) You buy me a couple of cold ones to help me make up my mind.
2) We find a volunteer to violate the most basic rules of tax sales; contact the owner. (I can hear PFM's boat engine now to run me over, (alternatively I might get offered to Uncle Tom), But this is an unusual case. All I want the volunteer to do is phone the owner and and say "Did you hear the tax sale was delayed until November? ;D
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Interesting strategy. Pretend to be a municipal official and advise the owner that the sale has been postponed...... and then win the tender.
As far as my odds go, I like giving/taking either 12 to 1 or 24 to 1 odds. Very handy when the bet is for beer.
Have you done a drive-by on this one? If so, then you too know that it will redeem.
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Interesting strategy. Pretend to be a municipal official and advise the owner that the sale has been postponed...... and then win the tender.
As far as my odds go, I like giving/taking either 12 to 1 or 24 to 1 odds. Very handy when the bet is for beer.
Have you done a drive-by on this one? If so, then you too know that it will redeem.
Patience Patience we are not even into the last week and it is a great time to be at the beach. You know my conditions. I figure with 2 more days of this heat I might get my volunteer. (Possibly by private message).
Of course redemption is not the only problem we face. This is "Bigfoots" home hunting territory. Even with a couple of wins his win average over me exceeds 5 to one in sales that don't redeem. :'(
I believe he lives about 10 minutes away. He will not let one let this one go by. My problem is the fierce competition around here unlike this guy 8) who knows the market soft spots.
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You must be patient, grasshopper. 8)
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Frank:
You are still alive? If yes, too bad for novices like me. Based on Dave2's posts. I figured that a really big 'gator got you.
Were you the winner on McDougall? Looked like a nice property if it did not redeem. I would have have given 12 to 1 odds on that one too.
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Frank:
You are still alive? If yes, too bad for novices like me. Based on Dave2's posts. I figured that a really big 'gator got you.
Were you the winner on McDougall? Looked like a nice property if it did not redeem. I would have have given 12 to 1 odds on that one too.
Netpred:
I am sorry but the last thing I will call you is a novice. Neither you or Frank have any thing to worry from big gators. Sharks like you both are treated well by big gators and myself. They call it "professional respect". ;D Thats what I like about Frank he is smooth and deadly, unlike a gator we never see him until we are missing a limb. Like Ameretto, not like the grappa that is reserved for rough people like me.
We may hear or may not hear about other wins at the right time. But back to business. I want to fulfill my first condition on Cramahe which I am expecting you to pay. I will make you a bet for my first condition. This hot weather is making me thirsty.
Lets get serious as we are now in the last week. Ignoring redemption risks and competitive risks (E.g. Big Foot, don't forget DRD (this is his hunting territory too), someone who brings along beautiful Chinese girls or Frank etc.) what is the potential big risk with the Cramahe property.
Hint you are only allowed to use public information available to all no legal searches. PM me and we will decide whether we expose the rest of the board or we will use it as a means to potentially teach people about the risks of this game. I mean the last time these guys had a tax sale or the time before, the winner ended up owing the government of Ontario 10 times their purchase price of $15,000.
It also explains why this might be headed for tax sale in the first place and why I think your redemption odds may be off and may also potentially make this a high risk play. Before we get serious we may have to both closely look at this one and you may decide the savings in legal fees (for a title search) is well worth my first condition.
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Oh oh.
I think that I might be smelling a dog here. Did we finalize our bet or can I still get out? ;)
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Oh oh.
I think that I might be smelling a dog here. Did we finalize our bet or can I still get out? ;)
I will rely on your innate sense of religious piety to decide. To ensure you have it we will go northeast of Campbelford? We might need an arbitrator? Anybody else passing through. Of course the judge/arbitrator is treated for free?
http://www.churchkeybrewing.com/
Reference was quoted earlier. How many types does it take for you to decide. To help the board decide I have included a photo of you.
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Frank:
You are still alive? If yes, too bad for novices like me. Based on Dave2's posts. I figured that a really big 'gator got you.
Were you the winner on McDougall? Looked like a nice property if it did not redeem. I would have have given 12 to 1 odds on that one too.
McDougall was redeemed this morning by the old owner....tax deed would have been registered tomorrow...delay getting approvals from Ministry of Northern Mines (aka...Ministry of takes a long time)....fogedaboudit. 8)
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Frank:
You are still alive? If yes, too bad for novices like me. Based on Dave2's posts. I figured that a really big 'gator got you.
Were you the winner on McDougall? Looked like a nice property if it did not redeem. I would have have given 12 to 1 odds on that one too.
McDougall was redeemed this morning by the old owner....tax deed would have been registered tomorrow...delay getting approvals from Ministry of Northern Mines (aka...Ministry of takes a long time)....fogedaboudit. 8)
My condolences.
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That hurts. That looked like a good one.
I thought the Ministry of Northern Affairs approval only applied North of French River particularly after mining claim act was changed. Obviously I was wrong too. Anyone know how far south they go?
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Oh oh.
I think that I might be smelling a dog here. Did we finalize our bet or can I still get out? ;)
Okay:
We don't have a lot of time and I will use this situation as a possible lesson that the devil is in the details.
First rule of tax sales is there is a reason it is going to tax sale. If a property is perfect it very rarely gets to final tax sale even if there are some last minute redemptions that make us all mad ( I would use stronger language but not on a family board.)
In this case the detail that is interesting is with OTS Jeff's website posting. ([
color=maroon]It is a feature property) ontariotaxsales.ca/nc/upcoming-tax-sales/municipality/TSuid/515/pBack/67/stype/featured/muid/47.html[/color]
Photos etc. look yummy until you read the words carefully. Quoting directly from Jeff's website:
Is there a house or cottage on the property? no
Is there some other structure on the property? Yes attached two car garageThat's funny that's not what the picture says. There are two possible situations
a) There is a misprint caused by the municipality or by one of Jeff's people. (He gets his information from the municipality and like an internet service provider has limited responsibility for its content.)
b) Or much more seriously there is a lot line problem. Do they occur? Yes in the country I have one right now on a property I purchased at a tax sale but it is my neighbours not mine because he decided to save money by not having a proper survey done.) We talk this afterrnoon about what is called in severence terms a "lot line adjustment"
Think about it if you discovered that a screwup was made and in effect your neighbour owned part of your house would you fight for it. We all would. Its is called adverse possession or more commonly a quit claim.
So if you win the tax sale you may have bought yourself a garage and heck of a big legal fight because adverse possession claims of adjoing property owners are one of the few that survive a tax sale. Gee I wonder if this is the reason it is going to tax sale in the first place.?
Big difference in value of the property too.
Now you have a decision to make like we all do? Bid or not bid and how much? If you think the house is part of the package/? we are talking at least 5 figures for the deposit alone?. Do you have the "COJONES" as the spanish say to face a loss like that if you make a mistake. Some of you are lucky you don't have a boss like me. ;D
On the other side of the coin it creates opportunities. I have made some interesting buys in cases like this.
This is the part of the business that people like Tri Target don't talk about. This background is behind the exchange between Netpred and myself earlier on these postings.
Sometimes in this business you have to make a decision to walk away. I of course already have my reward of some cold ones in the company of a smart ______ (fill in your own blanks) person on a hot July day.
Do I quit while I am ahead or get serious??? Decisions Decisions???? We will see later this week
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Dave, if you order the package for comparison you will see that it correctly states that there is a house on the property.
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Dave, if you order the package for comparison you will see that it correctly states that there is a house on the property.
Not disagreeing with you thats an assessment everyone must make pro or con.
So are you volunteering to make a phone call? (see my condition 2) earlier?
We still need an arbitrator and cold beer tastes good in July
Especially when Netpred is buying? ;D
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Dave's "condition 2" is specious. I suspect it was just offered in good humour but the idea of notifying an owner that the the tax sale redemption date has been extended, while pretending to be a municipal official is not only despicable, but likely to backfire. A tax deed, once registered, is final and binding and cannot be contested for any reason, except fraud! A tax deed obtained obtained using Dave's methodology could well be worthless - maybe even cost someone his island if substantial damages were awarded. I know, I know, Dave was just joking but it just goes to show that to bid on a tax sale you have to really know what you are doing, and the hidden consequences. Anyone bidding less than $72,125.00, (1/2 the assessed value), on this property is just wasting their time and money. Not 1 in 100 of you will still be bidding tax sales 5 years from now because you have not figured out the 3 keys to success. Firstly you have to do a fairly extensive amount of research, secondly you have to bid a fair price (not necessarily high, just fair), and thirdly you have to treat the former owners more than fairly. But maybe I am just trying to throw everybody off and lots of low ball bids and cheating is the real way to make big bucks on tax sales. Lots of luck.
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G2020:
Obviously although we all get frustrated when things redeem but its part of the game.
Yes my suggestion was in jest, but is not relevant in this case anyways because the property did redeem and Netpred will be downing some cold ones and having a good time (at my expense.)
Just wish I had your smarts to know how to find the ones that don't redeem.
That is why we wait until the last minute and should spend more time at the beach.
Speaking of research just a note on the upcoming one in Trent Hills. There were some errors in the original package and they have been corrected. For those that picked up the package early make sure you have the right package.
Dave2
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Cramahe is redeemed finally. You guys are great. How did you predict it !!!
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Cramahe is redeemed finally. You guys are great. How did you predict it !!!
Obviously not me? :'( (Netpred and Frank among others are the smart ones.) Hoping as Netpred enjoys his winnings I might get an insight. ;)
Onto the next one.
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Cramahe is redeemed finally. You guys are great. How did you predict it !!!
This one was easy - occupied and very well maintained. Do a drive by and you can tell well over 90% of the time. This one is not the sort of property that you get at a tax sale. The typical tax sale house was the one last year in Trenton. Uninhabited with 4 feet of water in the basement. Rotting drywall and mould. If you ever win a lot with a building on it, chances are good that the building is a knock down or requires extensive remedial work if it can be saved. In most cases, for derelict buildings, I think that the smart bid is on land value only (of course it can cost from 5k to 10k to demolish a building. :(
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Cramahe is redeemed finally. You guys are great. How did you predict it !!!
In most cases, for derelict buildings, I think that the smart bid is on land value only (of course it can cost from 5k to 10k to demolish a building. :(
Depending where it is and proximity to neighbours (like in the country) You can always see if the local fire department wants to burn it for practice to avoid demolition costs