Ontario Tax Sale Property Forum
Tax Sale Forum => Property Information => Topic started by: baller50 on September 08, 2011, 03:12:34 PM
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Anyone know the results?
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I'm curious as to why the companies who are selling info kits are not also posting the results in a public place?
Cheers to all, and it's been a very quiet summer, posting- wise.
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Was this a featured property on OTS? If it was, OTS is supposed to provide the sale results.
By the way, has anyone noticed that OTS is posting far fewer featured properties? It looks like the municipalities are tiring of paying the high fees. Of course with only a few featured properties, an OTS membership is virually worthless. Might as well flush a couple of hundred down the toilet. The competition now provides title searches so where is the value of an OTS mmbership?
Any comments from OTS Jeff?
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I'm curious as to why the companies who are selling info kits are not also posting the results in a public place
'Results' would be a great category for this website. I am sure who ever posted results would get a lot of applauds. Not too difficult...usually just a phone call. Those results would be archived on this site...what a great resource of info that would be! Also it would cut out OTS, one of the few reasons I would want to be a member.
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I'm curious as to why the companies who are selling info kits are not also posting the results in a public place?
Cheers to all, and it's been a very quiet summer, posting- wise.
If I posted any more with my luck Netpred would be totally wasted
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Was this a featured property on OTS? If it was, OTS is supposed to provide the sale results.
By the way, has anyone noticed that OTS is posting far fewer featured properties? It looks like the municipalities are tiring of paying the high fees. Of course with only a few featured properties, an OTS membership is virually worthless. Might as well flush a couple of hundred down the toilet. The competition now provides title searches so where is the value of an OTS mmbership?
Any comments from OTS Jeff?
The Innisfil property was not a Featured Property on OntarioTaxSales.ca. Therefore, InfoPaks were not available through OTS, nor will we be posting the results of the tax sale.
Right now there are 11 Featured Properties on OntarioTaxSales.ca. So far this year we`ve had 93 Featured Properties. I don`t know how many we`d had at this time last year, but I know that we had a total of 222 Featured Properties in 2010. Of course, this year is far from over, and I know that we have a number of Featured Properties coming up.
The vast majority of municipalities who have used our services continue to use our services. And we continue to get more municipalities coming on board.
As for our fees being high, I believe that virtually every municipality who has utilized OTS has found our fees to be quite reasonable.
As for the value of an OTS membership, here's an overview:
Free InfoPaks
o Today alone we have InfoPaks for 6 municipalities. The InfoPaks are $10 each, or free for our GOLD Members. That $60 saving on just today's Featured Properties goes a long way towards justifying the price of a one-year membership.
Tips on tax sales
o Over 200 Ontario municipalities have relied on our staff members for their tax sale expertise
o We've assisted them with more than 1,500 tax sales
o The lessons learned from the experiences that we've had, the situations we've encountered, and the problems we've helped solve, are shown in our Tips on Tax Sales
o We never stop running into new situations, and we pass on valuable new knowledge to our members through our Tips on Tax Sales
Tax sale results
o We now have detailed results of over 900 tax sales
o Find out, among other things,
How much money the property sold for
How many tenders were received
Assessed value
Pictures of the properties
Characteristics of the property, such as zoning, dimensions, if it's waterfront, etc.
o Results can be searched in a multitude of ways, using parameters such as
If there's a house or cottage on the property
Waterfront
Photos available
Vacant land
Commercial/industrial
Farmland
On a road
Municipality
County/Region
Geographic area of Ontario
Specific date range
Pictures
o Right now we have 137 pictures of upcoming tax sale properties available to our members
o All of the pictures were examined by our in-house professional before they were loaded onto OTS
o The person who examined these photos has a Diploma of Survey Technology and extensive professional experience in mapping
o His expertise enables him to identify and reject pictures whose accuracy is questionable
Title searches
o None of our title searchers have less than 20 years of experience
o Their expertise enables them to pick out title issues that other people might not be aware of
o They work in-house, so we are able to provide same-day, or at worst, next-day service
o We carry $2 million errors and omissions insurance, so we are covered in the event that we miss something on a search (we've never had a claim)
Newsletters
o We send our members a weekly newsletter, including
Information on other real estate investment opportunities
New tax sale listings
New tax sale results listings
Tips on Tax Sales
OTS is a professional company, staffed by highly competent professionals from diverse backgrounds, offering professional services to our members. I recognize that not everyone wants to utilize our services, or even acknowledge the value in what we do. But our members certainly recognize the value of our expertise, products and services. We will continue to provide our members with the highest calibre of expertise, the highst quality products, and the highest level of service.
Best regards,
Jeff Oberman
President
OntarioTaxSales.ca
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Thanks for your response Jeff.
I think that how I feel about your company is obvious so my comments are, to a degree, biased. However, I do have respect for you as a stand up guy who is willing to get involved here. So, good for you on that count.
Now my response to your post. This is not a rant but a well-reasoned response. Consider it well. First, your featured properties are down. Way down. Second, most of your featured properties are in Northern Ontario and nobody in this world (except for dave2 - but he is not from this world) bid on anything from Northern Ontario. Take a look at your current listings for proof of what I say. Your numbers are way down this year - we are 3/4 of the way through the year and entering the "low" season. This year you have had 93 featured properties but 222 last year. Your numbers are down. Way down.
As far as the current info packs being worth $60, that is nonsense. Noboby wants info packs on northern properties. They are only worth $10 each when someone wants to bid. Even then, a person can submit a tender in prescribed form without an info pack from your company. So as far as I am concerned, your current info packs have zero value.
As far as your fees go, you do not receive unfiltered comments from the municipalities. Question, if your fees are so reasonable, then why do many municipalities use Real Tax, but do not advertise on OTS? The answer is because of the fees. I have been told this by several treasurers. It doesn't make sense for them to use one service but not another. If the fees were reasonable they would use both. Do a confidential survey to confirm this if you wish.
You are correct that your results section is a good service. But is that worth $200? Especially since you only post results of those wonderful featured properties (mostly in northern Ontario).
It used to be that the photos of non-featured properties were useful. But now Tri-Target offers these for free. Funny how Tri-Target offers the same photos for free. Tri-Target also offers title searches to those of us who do not do our own. No membership fees for this service. Finally, if you check, Tri-Target has just obtained its first "featured" property. Of course the property happens also to be in northern Ontario.
As far as the other "benefits" of an OTS membership that you speak of, none are useful to any moderately experienced tax investor. Without trying to be rude, your tips and newsletter are useless to anyone except a raw newbie.
The fact is,that there are now fewer reasons than ever to have an OTS membership. I suspect that there will be fewer again next year this time.
Your final remark about professionalism is interesting. I do not wish to identify myself to you but I have emailed or left telephone messages to OTS regarding several issues and have never had a response from your company.
However, I give you credit for posting here and exposing yourself to comments like this.
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I am far from a fan of OTS , since they make it too easy for newbie idiots to overbid...of course they represent to towns they work for .. so it is their job to get newbie idiots to overbid for crap the town cannot sell ..
However I would tend to consider myself a bit above a newbie when it comes to taxsales but still think the membership is worth it. Yes the featured are down...(just throwing salt in the wound)
I would love nothing better then to see OTS go the way of the dodo , but in fairness they do have some value.. I also have no reason to question their quality or integrity
As per results..this forum should really have a results section. ... Mind you I have requested results tons of time on here and rarely get a response..did anyone notice that the innisfil results arent posted here...
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Your final remark about professionalism is interesting. I do not wish to identify myself to you but I have emailed or left telephone messages to OTS regarding several issues and have never had a response from your company.
Although I agree with Netpred for the most part, I have had a lot contact with OTS a few years back. Jeff replied by email to all my questions. The responses I got were always very professional but cautious.
That said, I have let my membership lapse.
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Second, most of your featured properties are in Northern Ontario and nobody in this world (except for dave2 - but he is not from this world) bid on anything from Northern Ontario.
Nothing wrong with Northern Ontario except I use different criteria there then in the south. Not a lot of towns in southern Ontario that will double or triple in size in the next couple of years and for some reason I have not been in a rush to let go of my (tax sale acquired) holdings close to town. ;D
Never was a fan of Beaujolais nouveau as I prefer my wine to age a little to maturity.
I don't have time right now to get into the pro's and cons of individual posters right now I am too busy with the basics of buying property cheap and selling for much more then the 20% profit objective of some other board members.
I am swamped with opportunities right now both on the buy and the sell side so much so that I don't even have time for the swat team stuff, but I will be patient. It won't go away. Some will work and some will fall by the wayside.
Unfortunately they all take time, but I expect by after thanksgiving might even have some catches.
I will do my part in time in board related activities but I will focus my efforts where I will get my best return. Always enjoyable in this business when the big ones don't always get away. The good thing is for other board members is I am totally knocked out for at least six weeks.
As Netpred doesn't believe me might have to send my driver down to help him take a look
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As Netpred doesn't believe me might have to send my driver down to help him take a look
Nice limo Dave.
Back to a results section of this forum...I don't know why it has not been done. It is all public info, and this forum could do a better job than OTS, [sorry Jeff].
'Results' would be a great category for this website. I am sure who ever posted results would get a lot of applauds.
As per results..this forum should really have a results section. ... Mind you I have requested results tons of time on here and rarely get a response..did anyone notice that the innisfil results arent posted here...
What do you think Rob? Some of the categories are not not to active and could be archived into general if space is a problem.
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Dave:
I now have all the proof that I need. Aliens exist and they are all named Dave. BTW, I thought that you drove a blue vehicle ;D.
26.2:
In theory I think that a results area is a great idea. The reality, however, has been well stated by PFM. There are only a few contributors here and many lurkers and non-contibutors. PFM has posted many results, but who else has? Do you think that a results area will cause the lurkers etc to actually get involved? As it now stands, there are fewer and fewer relevant posts here. I think that regular long time senior members are simply fed up with posting and getting nothing back from most people. I know for a fact that the most interesting conversations occur via private post and in some instances, involve members who are not particularly active here but who have lots to say. The issue really is one of how to get more people involved. That's why I thought that a private area might create an incentive. It has unfortunately not had this effect.
As an aside, I note that the results that Baller asked for have not been provided. I do not have these results as I had no interest in these properties. But it is unbelievable that nobody who has read this thread does not have these results. I am sure that somebody has them but the results remain unposted :(.
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Dave:
I now have all the proof that I need. Aliens exist and they are all named Dave. BTW, I thought that you drove a blue vehicle ;D.
One of the bonuses you get when you visit Franks favourite town of Moonbeam.
I don't know why everyone got so negative all of a sudden. I can't buy anything of value between May 24 and Thanksgiving anyways, too many people from the city,
and prices are too expensive as a result. If you don't believe me read my posts.
But guess what happens less then a month away. Like northern Ontario that everyone has been bashing. There are opportunities there but they are different.
We just have to be patient. I just hope everyone keeps getting discouraged. I prefer the ones when there are only two bidders. ;) In the interim I will keep working away. May have to even bet Netpred again
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I've been inactive, bidding-wise, the past few years, but stay current with the postings. I was a lurker until I'd read each & every post, but I then registered, as I thought I had a bit to contribute. The board seems quiet, now, but the postings of the select few, or so, seem to be ongoing. Being inactive, for the present, in the bidding, I don't bother checking the results, but have posted a few in the past.
The lurkers have their place, at first, but perhaps it's time to put in place a requirement that the lurkers register, at least, in order to read the current postings for, say, the last 6 to 12 months. At the very least, we'd know exactly how popular this board really is! If a member then never contributes in any way, a further requirement could be that they at least post their nom de plume after saying "Hi!". As well, I think that Rob would appreciate them chipping in the odd thank you for the great job he does here.
Dave2, from the look of things lately, you'd better start hunting for a beer wholesaler!
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Dave2, from the look of things lately, you'd better start hunting for a beer wholesaler!
Ernest Bidder: I agree with you the board has been too quiet lately.
Seeing as I always lose to Netpred time I made an appropriate gutsy bet with him.
Netpred: Assuming everything goes as planned I may have something that is better then a tax sale. Might even need additional partner(s). All you have to do is confirm my perspective and enjoy the beer that I already owe you in quantities safe enough to drive without the hastle from the guys or girls with the black and whites cars.
Let me know when you are by the local area? I am out of town tomorrow but around on the weekend. Who knows I might have to wean you from tax sales (for a short while) ;D
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What do you think of this idea:
A new board / subboard - called Tax Sale Sale Results.. but only visible to those who are registered?
Options could be (it would be viewable to:):
- Members
- Members At Least one post
- Members with least 5 (any number) of posts
- Guest [ ANYONE ]
Which option is most appealing to you personally?
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I think most new members want to get involved but are new and may feel they have nothing to contribute Maybe the idea of setting a new members area or an area on the site where instruction and guidance could be given might create to a new crop of hunters.
Then there are always 1 / 2 the people you see at auctions who may or may not visit the site but never see the value in adding anything because it might give someone else a leg up. The only way to bring those people in is implement a force posting / before viewing the forum. That's the it was before the internet, most BBS had a forced post rule before you could play any mods or download.
93 Featured Properties. vs 222 Featured Properties in 2010
That's interesting. I'll have to take a look at the number of properties overall posted in each of those years and compare the ratios. It might be a case of less properties posted this year.
When I run the above calculations, are there any other numbers (in relation to tax sale properties) members might be interested in learning about? Like how many Moonbean properties in 2006 + 2008 + 2010 were listed during a full moon :)
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My opinion would be to have it so that to view that area you have to be a member with at least 1 post. I am not a frequent poster on this website as most of the time I have nothing to contribute (unless someone has accounting related questions).
The thing is I am a young guy with my Chartered Accountants designation that is learning this business in my spare time and currently do not have the extra cash flow to not be an avid participant in tax sales. However my goal is to learn as much as I can (and have over the last couple of years) so that when I have the cash flow I can jump right in when properties in my area come up.
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- Members with least 5 (any number) of posts
I think [maybe] 5, but in the current year if that is possible. That way they are active and not just posting a quick five to see a lifetime of results. Also I think this will be an incentive to post, with a reward......results!
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I suppose an interesting option would be to somehow limit it to members who have posted results. Of course, if you can't access the results area you can't post results either. Sort of the the chicken or egg question, or more appropriately for this forum, Moonbeam or Dave2?
Rob, I think that I favour some level of posting. When I look at the old posts it is pretty clear that while there are now many more members and views, there were more people posting a couple of years back.
Another option of course is to charge a couple of hundred bucks a year for this service (like you know who ;)) and then give us fewer results every year ;D.
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Members with least 5 (any number) of posts
Of course people will just post crap to get to get 5 ..so maybe add membership for 3 months and 5 posts ..but if they post crap , report to rob and delete them
or simpler is just put the results in private members area..
then again..just make them public for everyone who is registered to see..
I have a couple houses in UK, the purchase price info is all public and there are several sites which give the info for free ..mouseprice zoopla etc screws the realtors as they cant spew crap about 900% increase this week..time to buy ..or the infamous .."gee I don't remember what it sold for but I think it was around one hundred trillion dollars" ( Canada / US lying pricks have all the previous data for neighbourhood sales but hide it from buyers..ask your realtor for a neighbourhood sales report before you make an offer..and this douchebag who is "working for you " will suddenly get amnesia..) I would call them cockroaches however the bugs would be offended by the association
( a buyers agent is the same as a "buyers assistant" at an auction..their job is to BS and confuse you and convince you to bid more and more for crap, ..bizarrely enough the realtors started ads a few month back about getting a buyers agent to help you..douchebags extraordinaire its like running ads trying to convince you to to get AIDS...as it is great for weight loss )
Estate agents in UK charge flat 1K more or less ..super high end estate agents change 1.5 % but will get you 5 to 10% more for the property
sorry , off and a tangent there.
..If we post results for everyone , it will help get rid of people making stupid low bids ($1 over 15K minimums on Bobcaygeon waterfront etc) as they will see what the stuff really goes for ..and will also show the no bids received stuff showing the crap that is out there..Im all for educating everyone in the game to get rid of fools...I hate losing to a fool who overbids
Note..we still don't have the results for Innisfill posted ;D whats the pins ? , I will post results when they transfer
As a bonus offer..if Rob sets up a results forum.....I Will post results for the first 100 requested pins ...( tax sales only, no buyer info , just price )
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What do you think of this idea:
A new board / subboard - called Tax Sale Sale Results.. but only visible to those who are registered?
Options could be (it would be viewable to:):
- Members
- Members At Least one post
- Members with least 5 (any number) of posts
- Guest [ ANYONE ]
Which option is most appealing to you personally?
Rob:
My dream list wishes are probably too difficult for your capable execution.
a) members overall (I don't have a strong opinion about the number of posts)
b) guests only see all the ones that redeem or go for an unaffordable/unrealistic high amount.
c) the really good sale purchases are reserved for members with at least 5 posts
d) ideally the member's nickname who bought them is also displayed.
e) as an option all of the bids are displayed
In a small way whatever the rules I will continue to do my part. In a year like this where my priority has been on the development and sale side of the business it will be less of a contribution then when I have to get active on the purchase side hopefully to replenish depleted inventory.
Finally it would be nice if we had a (well restricted access)summary of the trophy purchases (If they exist, I ain't telling). Some of the people here like this guy 8)
are so smooth I can just imagine some of their classic purchases.
One of these days I will get into their league but I have to spend more time in the minor leagues first.
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Members with least 5 (any number) of posts
Of course people will just post crap to get to get 5 ..so maybe add membership for 3 months and 5 posts ..but if they post crap , report to rob and delete them
or simpler is just put the results in private members area..
then again..just make them public for everyone who is registered to see..
I have a couple houses in UK, the purchase price info is all public and there are several sites which give the info for free ..mouseprice zoopla etc screws the realtors as they cant spew crap about 900% increase this week..time to buy ..or the infamous .."gee I don't remember what it sold for but I think it was around one hundred trillion dollars" ( Canada / US lying pricks have all the previous data for neighbourhood sales but hide it from buyers..ask your realtor for a neighbourhood sales report before you make an offer..and this douchebag who is "working for you " will suddenly get amnesia..) I would call them cockroaches however the bugs would be offended by the association
( a buyers agent is the same as a "buyers assistant" at an auction..their job is to BS and confuse you and convince you to bid more and more for crap, ..bizarrely enough the realtors started ads a few month back about getting a buyers agent to help you..douchebags extraordinaire its like running ads trying to convince you to to get AIDS...as it is great for weight loss )
Estate agents in UK charge flat 1K more or less ..super high end estate agents change 1.5 % but will get you 5 to 10% more for the property
sorry , off and a tangent there.
..If we post results for everyone , it will help get rid of people making stupid low bids ($1 over 15K minimums on Bobcaygeon waterfront etc) as they will see what the stuff really goes for ..and will also show the no bids received stuff showing the crap that is out there..Im all for educating everyone in the game to get rid of fools...I hate losing to a fool who overbids
Note..we still don't have the results for Innisfill posted ;D whats the pins ? , I will post results when they transfer
As a bonus offer..if Rob sets up a results forum.....I Will post results for the first 100 requested pins ...( tax sales only, no buyer info , just price )
Sounds like you have had some bad experiences with real estate agents.....sorry to hear that. There are many excellent agents out there who will indeed represent the best interest of their clients and will have provided all of the information (that you say we apparently hide) in order to help the client understand the true value of the property in question. To me, this is the only way to do business.
I have no problem pulling info for people on sales prices for properties in Ontario. In order to get sales results it will just take having someone call the municipality in question or, if they are willing to wait until they transfer, we can pull all requested sales prices (I have no problem helping out in this manner as well if a forum is created for results and am willing to go back through some previous sales if people have requests). If anyone has questions about a sales price of a property and would prefer to ask privately, so long as they are an active contributor, I have no problem pulling that info as well. I know I do not have a lot of posts myself as I really do not have much to offer with regards to actual tax sale advice, I would love to help out on the general real estate side and posting this sort of info.
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Sounds like you have had some bad experiences with real estate agents.....sorry to hear that. There are many excellent agents out there who will indeed represent the best interest of their clients and will have provided all of the information (that you say we apparently hide) in order to help the client understand the true value of the property in question. To me, this is the only way to do business.
hahahaha...do you practice that in front of a mirror ....of course you represent the best interest of the client if you represent the seller .as its in their best interest to make the buyer overpay....but the buyers agent.....also wants the buyer to overpay
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Again, just plain ignorance. If you decide that you would like to have a civil discussion on issues then I'm all for that. If you want to continue to attack myself and all other REALTORS based on some bad experience that you may have had, then feel free to continue in your ignorant bliss. I thought this forum was to help people, apparently I was wrong.
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This forum is to help people. It is also for the exchange of views and opinions. I have said it before and I will say it again, PFM can be very blunt, but I usually find myself agreeing with much of what he says. On this topic I tend again to side with PFM. In my experience (as limited as it is) unethical and incompetent real estate agents outnumber the ethical and competent.
As an aside, I note that the governing body for agents is currently under investigation by the Competition Bureau. This Bureau has serious concerns about how the MLS is used and who has access to it.
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Sorry, but someone calling you an "effin douchebag realtor" without even knowing you at all speaks volumes to their own character and goes beyond the limits of exchanging views and opinions. To question ones integrity without cause shows an ignorance that is not called for in any facet of life.
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You guys wonder why more people do not participate in forums such as this...maybe it is because of keyboard warriors such as Pfm!! Really, who would want to try to help out if that is the reaction that you get from the regulars on a forum?
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I setup the board, and for now set it to only members without a post restriction just to get things started. We can add the 5 post limit and perhaps a waiting period in time.
Things get heated up quickly.
MHT, don't take any comments personally, people will be judged on there own words. For the general public real estate agents provide a huge assistance and will generally get a better home for a cheaper price than most people can do on there own. For someone like Pfm or others who have gone through the process 20 or more times they feel that agents can be against there best interest at times.
In one of Malcolm gladwell's novels he explains that it is not always in the best interest for real estate agents to get the best possible price. They compared the numbers of when and how long an agent's personal property was on the market compared to a clients. They found that on average agents will keep there property on the market for a few weeks longer and get about 10,000 more for a home. If a house sells for $10,000 more, the agent will only gain $500 more (using 5% comm. value) and the extra few weeks on the market increase advertising costs. But if the agent owns the home the extra few weeks on the market and advertising costs are nothing compared to the extra $10,000 income.
I personally find real estate agents helpful, useful and important. If I were buying or selling a home, I would use a real agent's services because they would sell at a higher price than I would have be able to get on my own and they handle negotiations. Using one when buying makes sense because it doesn't cost you anything (it costs the seller). Does it increase the overall cost of the home price? Yes... but agents are necessary... for most people.
Does anyone have any opinions on lawyers?
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I personally find real estate agents helpful, useful and important. If I were buying or selling a home, I would use a real agent's services because they would sell at a higher price than I would have be able to get on my own and they handle negotiations. Using one when buying makes sense because it doesn't cost you anything (it costs the seller). Does it increase the overall cost of the home price? Yes... but agents are necessary... for most people.
Does anyone have any opinions on lawyers?
I am not going to wade into the discussion except to refer people to the following URL
http://agentgenius.com/real-estate-news-events/forsalebyowner-com-founder-gives-up-on-own-listing-hires-real-estate-broker/
Bottom line is the founder of for sale by owner used a real estate agent to sell his own place.
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Rob:
I do not agree with you on this one. Most agents are scummy. Pfm may be over the top with his language, but there is merit in his message. The guy knows a thing or two. There are a few decent agents but most are commission driven. They get paid on a sale and get paid more when the price is higher. Agents invented the "Oklahoma" scam and a host of other scams. Most will do almost anything for a commission - especially if they won't get caught. Now, if you know this about them, you can play them and use it to your advantage.
There is now competition on the horizon and the agents are circling the wagons. That is why the Competition Bureau is out for them.
Lawyers? Find a competent and ethical one and you will be set for life. There are also bad apples out there, but consider this, an agent may make $25k in commission or more, but only if the deal closes. A lawyer might make $500 on the same deal irrespective of whether it closes. Who do you think is on your side? Who has a financial interest in having the deal close? So what if there are issues with the property that affect title? The agent really doesn't care about these problems - they just want a deal to close so they can get their commission. Has anyone here ever heard of an agent telling his/her client "don't close"?
Of course not. They blame the lawyers for not closing. Does anyone really believe that lawyers take a perverse pleasure from not closing deals? Lawyers are there to represent their clients. In my view, most agents are there for the commission.
The real problem with lawyers is that they want to be paid. People would rather not pay. So if you want a cheap lawyer, you probably get a crappy lawyer. I also think that large firms do "milk" files - so avoid them unless you have really deep pockets. The trick is to find a small guy (or gal) who is competent, ethical and will work for a fair fee - say around $300 per hour.
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I personally find real estate agents helpful, useful and important. If I were buying or selling a home, I would use a real agent's services because they would sell at a higher price than I would have be able to get on my own and they handle negotiations. Using one when buying makes sense because it doesn't cost you anything (it costs the seller). Does it increase the overall cost of the home price? Yes... but agents are necessary... for most people.
Does anyone have any opinions on lawyers?
I am not going to wade into the discussion except to refer people to the following URL
http://agentgenius.com/real-estate-news-events/forsalebyowner-com-founder-gives-up-on-own-listing-hires-real-estate-broker/
Bottom line is the founder of for sale by owner used a real estate agent to sell his own place.
Dave:
This is exactly why the Competition Bureau is after real estate agents. They have, and continue to exercise, monopolistic power over the MLS. This is, according to the Competition Bureau, illegal. Imagine, the founder of this service was forced to use the services of an agent to fully access the MLS in order to sell his own Condo. This is not an argument for agents, but a condomnation of their practices. This also speaks volumes about the control exercised of the entire industry by traditional agents. The real estate boards have always retaliated against any "discount" agents who permit their clients to access the MLS for a small fee. The Competition Bureau will change things for the better.
Why should I pay 5% of the sale price to list my property on the MLS? Any agents out there got an answer for this question? I'd love to hear it if so.
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Realtors are your best friend as a seller, as they will eat their young for an extra dollar..which is in your best interest as a seller ...except when the scam by the Realtor kicks in...
They give you an inflated value for your home to get the listing and then start with the excuses about the market being bad, etc etc when the offers come in low ..Of course most people think their house is worth more then it is and wont sign with a realtor who gives them an honest opinion so it is partly our fault...
So great friend as seller..unfortunately very few are just sellers..as you will become a buyer also
The ultimate damage is done when people buy the next house based on what they think the will get on the old and end up over paying and deep in it
As per being a douchebag..I will give that a minor percent of realtors may be less then complete douchebags , and maybe one or two are even human ....of course you did jump in spew the whole BS about the POS deals ....but who am I to judge ;D
Read the twisted stats by the Toronto Real Estate Board..they should be sued for the crap they spew as they mutilate stats to always show an increase ..even if statscan and the CREA show decreases
If you actually believe most realtors don't eat their young and when you look around your office you don't see sharks and pitbulls..you seriously are too far gone ...GO DIAMOND ..GO GOLD..GO PLATINUM..YEEHAA
As per MLS.. It is complete price fixing and was illegal under the old act. Under the new act (July 09 I believe) this is not illegal as price fixing is no longer an illegal act unless you have a complete monopoly which they don't as anyone can start a similar database..
Under the new act oil companies can openly fix prices at the pumps as there is more then one company and therefore people have a choice...yes that's right you might want to read that again to grasp the stupidity ..
It is now completely legal for Miele to force all "agents" to sell their dishwashers at the identical price ( which Miele does) and completely legal to cut off a dealer who sells for one penny less..unless that dealer can prove that Miele will bankrupt him if they cut him off...but the only way to prove you will go bankrupt ..is to immediately go bankrupt after Miele cuts you off..but bankrupt companies cant sue and neither can the shareholder so the customer pays 2k for the dishwasher
The competition bureaus thinking is that the market will dictate an you can buy another brand or don't buy at all ..of course the same rules apply to the price fixed gasoline .The government position is now....If you don't like the price of gas..don't drive
Now Companies and Distributors can charge dealers who sell on the internet more for the product then a retail store in order to maintain high prices to the consumer.
If a dealer has a complaint..the new competition bureau rules eliminate the government enforcement and criminal charges,,its now a civil matter and people can sue instead ..but bankrupt companies cant sue..hmmm
So the realtor boards can do what they want with the MLS but nothing stops someone from starting their own database ..much like most of the world..
The CREA settled this case as they were violating the old act but not the new.. and the government would have won a useless legal win but the win would be a huge public relations nightmare for the realtors..for we all know they are saintly wonderful people and such a loss would stain their virginal white reputations . By opening up the MLS , You still need to have a realtor to sign up , CREA charges excessive fees and reduces the risk of a better database coming online
This was far from a victory as you still have to deal with a realtor to get listed.
The low commission guys are perfectly free to start their own database and take on the MLS..Take a look at other systems around the world and you will see the MLS is actually a crap database feature wise
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Dave:
Why should I pay 5% of the sale price to list my property on the MLS? Any agents out there got an answer for this question? I'd love to hear it if so.
Netpred:
Maybe because they can perform a service for you. Like the problem I have right now as a potential seller. Just purchased more then 1/2 dozen properties for better then tax sale prices.
Quality better then anything I have seen this year on this board that actually sold. Putting it in meat terms grade AA plus "Angus" beef. Clean with an excellent location
in southern Ontario, no Moonbeam distances, nice and handy to Toronto within admittedly long commuting distance to Toronto. My purchase price was 1/4 of assessed value and 1/10 of current market value.
Only problem beef is quite young and will take a while to age. My problem is that I also have a chance at a bunch of salmon as well on which I made an offer yesterday, let alone a bunch of cottages and something that a select few know something about
but I have been so busy that I have not had time to pursue.
All it requires is the certification stamp of someone who is owed a lot of beers as better then tax sale. Then life gets interesting. Who knows maybe that person might even want to decide to become a beef lover himself if you catch my drift. ;D
Of course I might have to increase my purchase bid somewhat because for me this board has been expensive lately. As ernest bidder noted those beer wholesalers can get expesive.
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Dave:
You know how I have spent many weekends this summer >:(. I expect to be passing through at the usual place a day later than usual. Is it good for you?
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Dave:
You know how I have spent many weekends this summer >:(. I expect to be passing through at the usual place a day later than usual. Is it good for you?
Understand. Around Saturday and Sunday, travelling on business Monday. The longer you delay the meeting date I should caution you that there is an increasing
risk the beer might evaporate particularly if I have to remove some of the caps to ensure that it is not getting Skunky.