Joke of the Day

[Frank]

Civil Servants:

Do you know why Civil Servants don't look out their windows in the morning?....answer at the bottom.

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So I call up this fellow, who is listed in the tax sale information as the person to call for further information on the property. 

he answers the phone with a ' well you are the 69th person to call about this property and aske dumb questions'....'no I have not been out there, they don't let me out of the office'....'I don't really know anything about the property, so I really can't help you with it, you are the bidder and it is up to you to find out what you can'.

So, I'm calling him as he is the one listed on the property, and he knows squat...hasn't even taken the time to do a drive by.  He is in charge and can't tell me if the buildings on the property are legal, and what their legal uses might be (he's also the planner).....buddy, get a life.   Oh, and he completely didn't know what the hell I was talking about with respect to road allowances.

When I did that job, I had the information you were looking for, and I didn't sluff you off.  Your name is on the ad as THE PERSON to call. 
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Answer...Cause they wouldn't have anything to do in the afternoon.   

[Frank]

ps.

I'm not saying that all Civil Servants are inept....but this one sure was.

[Dave2]

Civil Servants:

Answer...Cause they wouldn't have anything to do in the afternoon.   

Lately I have found the ones I have dealt with very helpful like for G2020's Huntcamp that unfortunately redeemed, (Still unhappy I finally didn't get a chance to compete against PFM),  but my problem is the challenges you face when someone makes an honest mistake.  Here is the thread from a couple of years ago.

 http://taxsaleproperty.org/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=ddbdee0f421d2a9dbcdc1788e9e35a83&topic=1063.msg5098#msg5098

[Pfm1011]

he answers the phone with a ' well you are the 69th person to call about this property and aske dumb questions'....'no I have not been out there, they don't let me out of the office'....'I don't really know anything about the property, so I really can't help you with it, you are the bidder and it is up to you to find out what you can'.

I have always been lucky with civil servants but I only bug them when I have completed all the research possible ..and never ask them questions that they cannot legally answer..


I can only guess how stupid the questions he is getting re: sandy bay   are.   I  would not want to be fielding the calls from the masses as most people really cant grasp that the staff can tell us very little except for specific legal facts ..NOT opinions , not interpretations , not guesses, not valuations etc  etc



Frank as an ex civil servant I am sure you can appreciate the amount of stupid questions you can get..and how people will do no research, simply call staff

Of course most of these are people who will bid the min ..It appears my guess of 87 tenders may be low'

that said ..he shouldnt have put his name on the form if he was going to be an idiot.. have to love employees who cant be fired

[Frank]

I can assure you that my questions are to the point, and not at all stupid.  I am fully aware of their limitations, but they should be able to tell you if it is a seasonal or year round road; if the shore road allowance is still there; and that they can and must provide you with a copy of the stat dec. 

They did finally fire the dim-wit in Nobel.   It only took them six years and two tangos with me to do it.

I'm sure he is getting a lot of dumb calls......that is the nature of the business, get used to it or get out.  One doesn't have to start a conversation with an attitude like that. 

I have always been lucky with civil servants but I only bug them when I have completed all the research possible ..and never ask them questions that they cannot legally answer..


I can only guess how stupid the questions he is getting re: sandy bay   are.   I  would not want to be fielding the calls from the masses as most people really cant grasp that the staff can tell us very little except for specific legal facts ..NOT opinions , not interpretations , not guesses, not valuations etc  etc



Frank as an ex civil servant I am sure you can appreciate the amount of stupid questions you can get..and how people will do no research, simply call staff

Of course most of these are people who will bid the min ..It appears my guess of 87 tenders may be low'

that said ..he shouldnt have put his name on the form if he was going to be an idiot.. have to love employees who cant be fired

[Pfm1011]

I can assure you that my questions are to the point, and not at all stupid.  I am fully aware of their limitations, but they should be able to tell you if it is a seasonal or year round road; if the shore road allowance is still there; and that they can and must provide you with a copy of the stat dec. 

Im absolutely sure your questions are to the point ...Of the 68 before you however.....



two tangos???..we are all aware of the one...

[Frank]

I can assure you that my questions are to the point, and not at all stupid.  I am fully aware of their limitations, but they should be able to tell you if it is a seasonal or year round road; if the shore road allowance is still there; and that they can and must provide you with a copy of the stat dec. 

Im absolutely sure your questions are to the point ...Of the 68 before you however.....



two tangos???..we are all aware of the one...

Second one was the cottage on Miller Lake that I won last summer, and the guy came in the day before my deed would have been issued...not necessarily his fault, but right after that they refused to extend his contract...put two and three together, and I'm sure the council viewed it as a loss to the town.

[Dave2]

he answers the phone with a ' well you are the 69th person to call about this property and aske dumb questions'....'no I have not been out there, they don't let me out of the office'....'I don't really know anything about the property, so I really can't help you with it, you are the bidder and it is up to you to find out what you can'.

I can only guess how stupid the questions he is getting re: sandy bay   are.   I  would not want to be fielding the calls from the masses as most people really cant grasp that the staff can tell us very little except for specific legal facts ..NOT opinions , not interpretations , not guesses, not valuations etc  etc

Of course most of these are people who will bid the min ..It appears my guess of 87 tenders may be low'

Gee:

87 Expected tender responses. I didn"t realize that Rice Lake was so popular.  Should be real easy for civil servants as well; weeds weeds weeds.  Of course there is a segment of the population who I don't
believe hangs out here; may have heard the singular not not the plural; "Weed, Weed" and that might explain the popularity.  

Gee I may have to drive out to Grafton next week although the down side is I may have to pay some overdue debts to Netpred and for good measure he will probably insist I am designated driver.  

Any one else coming out PM me and we will go for a coffee or a cold one. For the board's information I am not going after this one because of other possible funds committments; such as Cochrane where I have been approached to help fund some construction.

Decisions Decisions; always interesting question:  "Do you cash out and invest in Franks favourite town of Moonbeam or increase your bet 

[Dave2]

Gee:

Gee I may have to drive out to Grafton next week although the down side is I may have to pay some overdue debts to Netpred and for good measure he will probably insist I am designated driver.  

Certainly can confirm with the coming of warm weather that Netpred was around to collect some overdue beer bets.  

Inspection of the Sandy bay property unfortunately revealed some unwanted tenants; who unfortunately don't know how to use the toilet; Hint they have a mask and four legs;

Got into an interesting discussion with Netpred whether you can get a building permit if the existing structures are deamed "derilect structures".  Certainly they are teardown.  

PFM/Frank:  any idea if you get a new building permit if existing structures are condemmed.

[netpred]

Before anyone chimes in, some background information. The building is a teardown. No foundation, rotted rim joist and floor joists, sagging, leaning, falling over, presently tenanted by several families of masked bandits that have also taken to tearing up the interior and pulling down insulation. Mould and rot everywhere. A septic system composed of a 45 gallon drum. I could go on and I will try to post some pics later.

Bottom line: Complete teardown. Not even G2020 would try to rehab this one - and that man has rehabbed stuff that I can't even imagine. Figure at least $5k, but more like $10k, to teardown.

It gets worse. A year 'round watercourse down the middle of the lot and flood plain - I sunk in the muck near the waterfront (sorry about the mud in you car Dave).

Now, the million dollar question. Will OTS Jeff (or the municipality) guarantee that a permit would be issued if torn down? I think not, but the billion dollar question is whether the conservation authority will issue a permit? Dave will owe me more beer because the answer is no. Before anyone bids on this one they should check with conservation whether a permit will be issued to rebuild a "derelict" structure. I know the answer so I feel a bit guilty about taking more beer from Dave, but of course, I am more thirsty than guilty  .

Dave and I have another side bet that is private on this one. I will also win that bet.

[Dave2]

Before anyone chimes in, some background information. The building is a teardown. No foundation, rotted rim joist and floor joists, sagging, leaning, falling over, presently tenanted by several families of masked bandits that have also taken to tearing up the interior and pulling down insulation. Mould and rot everywhere. A septic system composed of a 45 gallon drum. I could go on and I will try to post some pics later.

Bottom line: Complete teardown. Not even G2020 would try to rehab this one - and that man has rehabbed stuff that I can't even imagine. Figure at least $5k, but more like $10k, to teardown.

It gets worse. A year 'round watercourse down the middle of the lot and flood plain - I sunk in the muck near the waterfront (sorry about the mud in you car Dave).

Now, the million dollar question. Will OTS Jeff (or the municipality) guarantee that a permit would be issued if torn down? I know the answer so I feel a bit guilty about taking more beer from Dave, but of course, I am more thirsty than guilty  .

Dave and I have another side bet that is private on this one. I will also win that bet.

Netpred:

Sooner or later your winning streak will end.   You have to admit it was not all bad yesterday; aside from muddy shoes; a chauffer driven ride (He complained that my four year old  Oshawa built car did not have a bar in it), free beer (only two to be legal) and some of the local ladies wearing hotpants with the warm weather.  

What I am surprised is that you did not mention what I consider the worst risk with this property?
Is it always your habit to leave the worst for the last?

If you cannot answer the question it will cost you a beer to find out.

[Pfm1011]

PFM/Frank:  any idea if you get a new building permit if existing structures are condemned.

I do not believe there is any orders ( correct me if I am wrong )  so therefore it is not technically "condemned"   It is a knockdown but I believe you can rebuilt on the same foot prints...The foundation is toppling bricks so you are ground up "renovation".

Still concerned about  septic as you are only a bit above the water

I really haven't looked in to it hard as I am taking a pass on this one   as the cottage "resort"  next door will make this place unbearable in the summer.... do what you want and drop the nicest cottage on the land and you still have the 80 tourists a week next door making this a living hell ... drunken a**holes climbing on your boats and jetskis.  kids screaming in the park..  and these are real low budget clowns..... You will have to go to Downtown Toronto  to get away from the noise.

You can forget  leaving gear out during the week..it will evaporate.

too bad as sunsets would be good due to west facing and  location is not bad for jet skiing to Hastings etc....Its only march so I presume more shall come

[netpred]

PFM/Frank:  any idea if you get a new building permit if existing structures are condemned.

I do not believe there is any orders ( correct me if I am wrong )  so therefore it is not technically "condemned"   It is a knockdown but I believe you can rebuilt on the same foot prints...The foundation is toppling bricks so you are ground up "renovation".

Still concerned about  septic as you are only a bit above the water

I really haven't looked in to it hard as I am taking a pass on this one   as the cottage "resort"  next door will make this place unbearable in the summer.... do what you want and drop the nicest cottage on the land and you still have the 80 tourists a week next door making this a living hell ... drunken a**holes climbing on your boats and jetskis.  kids screaming in the park..  and these are real low budget clowns..... You will have to go to Downtown Toronto  to get away from the noise.

You can forget  leaving gear out during the week..it will evaporate.

too bad as sunsets would be good due to west facing and  location is not bad for jet skiing to Hastings etc....Its only march so I presume more shall come

The proper question to ask is whether the conservation authority will issue a permit for a "derelict" structure. You will need a permit from the conservation authority to rebuild and nobody should bid on this one before phoning them and asking the question that I posed. I know what the answer is. That is why I also have asked whether OTS Jeff and/or the municipality will guarantee permits.

The really difficult problem here is the use of the word "derelict". "Derelict" does not require work orders etc. As an aside, if there are no orders now against this property (and I don't know if there are) there is always the risk that work orders can be slapped on after closing.

Anyone considering to bid should drive out and see it themselves and should also contact the conservation authority. This one has the potential to bite you good.

[Dave2]

Netpred/Pfm:

Interesting enough my concern with this one is something neither of you have mentioned.  
Derilict or condemned structures and conservation authorities I understand and know how to assess.

The one I am worried about is a possible boundary dispute.  It was already covered in an earlier post.

http://taxsaleproperty.org/forum/index.php?topic=1945.0

OTS Jeff claimed he had the best technology available and as they advertise they have handled 15,000 tax sale properties he should know what he is talking about.  

My concern is if the property boundary is off 20 or 30 feet the property is unuseable because of the stream in the center.  

What is the risk I honestly don't know how to assess.  I will deal with racoons, conservation authority, health unit etc.
This one could be major or not a worry at all    Without a surveyor check?

Why do these issues come up the first time Jeff uses the technology? LOL

This is one I am glad I am not bidding because as I have said before I have too much on my plate already.  

[netpred]

Dave, you give far too much credit to yourself. Everyone here knows that you will have boundary, easment and right of way issues with many of these older cottage properties. These will all survive a tax sale, but my feeling is that if the place has been there for as long as this one has, then these issues are largely non-issues. I know that you can no longer get prescriptive title after the property went into Land Titles, but there is not much doubt in my mind that any boundary issues would have been resolved by adverse possession long ago.

The real issue is that conservation may not issue any permits at all. This cottage cannot be used as it is. There are serious and obvious health issues.

Of course nobody should rely on this free and non-professional opinion. Speak to a lawyer to confirm all of this, especially if you are seriously considering a bid.

Now, about those beers you owe me.