Upcoming sale

[LarasDad]

Happy New Year, folks.  I'm new to this forum but I've read the bulk of the postings -- what a great education -- thanx, guys ! 

I'm hoping the "pro's" will help enlighten me further (even though I'm breaking one of the cardinal rules, show no interest - but then, I haven't said where or when).

Here's the background info:

46.5 acres zoned agric (buildings not mentioned in ad, two gravel road frontages)

From the title search,
 - last purchased 2000 for $122.5k (apparently no mortgage) only one name registered, female

 - "Remarks: Planning Act Statement" (not sure what it covers)

 - 2001, private mortgage for $78.5k, man (could be lawyer or property developer or ?) & woman, different surnames

 - 2008, tax arrears cert for $2365.

From township zoning maps, there's a wind turbine on adjacent land (part of large windfarm).

From Conservation Authority aerial mapping, there's an EP drainage ditch running from the S-W corner to midway on the west ? of the north lot line effectively chopping the house portion on the smaller acreage from the much larger currently (my guess) unfarmed piece.  Adds up to 6+ acres useless and you need CA permit to bridge it - roughly 125 ft wide ! There's a 3? acre severance (from original 50 ac parcel) in the S-E corner with a fairly new house.

From our drive-by on the weekend (and no we didn't talk to the neighbours) the brick bungalow is smallish, there's a separate garage+workshop, run-in shed, derelict vehicles & ass't crap, and 2 large german shepherds.

From the package, the 2009 assesment is $100.5k, $53.8k res, $46.7k farm.

From phone number lookup, one, maybe two same names (RR vs street number), but not same as owner.

From the 2009 rate table on the web, works out to $802.45 give or take.

From my visit to the township office, according to the clerk the difference between the 2008 amount and the $10k+ they want now is the 2009 taxes + legal fees (mucho, no); she couldn't supply me with the Statutory Decleration - "we're too small a municipality, talk to our lawyer"; she also volunteered after I prodded that the mortgage holders had been contacted by their lawyer but no funds received as yet (does the name "Commisso" ring any warning bells ?); also interest-wise, she's handed out a "few" packages.

So 2 questions.

From MLS, typical farmland in this area goes for $2k, so assume you can get $160k (30 acres workable + house) if you're willing to wait, or $100k at firesale pricing.

1. How do the mortgage holders protect their interest (assuming there's $65k still owing) ?  Can they foreclose at any point in the process and f' it up for everybody else ?  Or would they bid, say $24k ($100 - $65 - $11) ? Or bid $84k if they're willing to wait ? Or ?? Any thoughts ?

2. If I were the successful bidder, and I  paid the balance right after opening, how long to get the tax deed ?

addendum: Any strategy suggestions ?

[worldjohn]

It was cancelled this morning. Welcome to the tax sale game.  Thats the way it happens too often. You put in lots of time and effort and some money and it gets cancelled. I've learned to wait until the last few days with these types of properties but I've even had them cancelled on me on the last day. Its a little frustrating but for future referance there are hints that will tell you that its likely to get cancelled:
if its a occupied residence
if its sounds too good to be true
A private mortage holder will ususally pay it off rather than lose their money.
Good luck

[Dave2]

Happy New Year, folks.  I'm new to this forum but I've read the bulk of the postings -- what a great education -- thanx, guys ! 

So 2 questions.

2. If I were the successful bidder, and I  paid the balance right after opening, how long to get the tax deed ?

1. Although I am a guy personally I have always wondered if the smartest participants here are women even though they may not talk a lot about it.  One of the sharper members I had fortune to meet certainly impressed me with her sagacity.    

2. Based on personal experience getting the tax deed has varied from 7 days to almost 3 nerve racking months (In Northern Ontario where they check with the Ministry if any mining taxes maybe owing which is not fast.) For a nice piece of property it is never fast enough.  

There has been a lot of discussion in other posts about buying the second bid.  One of the
disadvantages of this strategy is the additional time that maybe needed to execute the strategy.  

3. There are more qualified people then me to talk about your other question(s).  Bidding strategy is not something I generally talk in the public domain except for ones that I don't want to see people get burned on. 

[new_1]

Hey, Dave2
How would you come up with the idea that smartest participants here are women?

 

[netpred]

Hey, Dave2
How would you come up with the idea that smartest participants here are women?

 

His wife told him!

[LarasDad]

thanx for all the replies - yeh it sucks - shoulda checked the website before I bothered posting !

but the exercise was worth it -- I'll sure be checking the gazette a lot more regular now

[Dave2]

I agree as most of the members of this board so to speak do not have avatars it is difficult to be sure.  We can all dream though and imagine if it turned out that most of the members were both beautiful or handsome in addition to the brains we already know they had. 

The only way we be sure if we are lucky like PFM and be in the tropics where I am sure he is now on his boat.   .  I can imagine him as or (with )a beautiful blonde already.

The real smart one on this board is Frank who can enjoy the beauty but no one can tell he is looking.   

[Frank]

The real smart one on this board is Frank who can enjoy the beauty but no one can tell he is looking.   

Never confuse age with wisdom.  Although I do enjoy beauty...my wife can tell when I am looking.  Not one bid submitted last year...everything I was looking at got redeemed...and the one that I should have been in on was won by a lucky fella (a little island if I recall)...he even tried to get me to bid against him, probably so he could buy me out if I was second and come out smelling like an even better rose.

[Dave2]

Frank:  

Anytime I come up against you, PFM or a few other professionals whom I won't name on this board I expect to get my ass kicked. You guys were nice to me last year but I don't expect it to continue. You wouldn't believe how hard it is to stay out of your collective
way.  The only reason I might occasionally win something is persistance and that is also why I look for taxsale property in such high profile spots like Moonbeam.  

Unfortunately if you are lucky then the real work begins.  I spent most of last week in the bush with a chainsaw crew and digging septic test holes.   Next I have to face the music from all the people who always don't like a rezoning. 

Dave2

[Frank]

Frank:   

Unfortunately if you are lucky then the real work begins.  I spent most of last week in the bush with a chainsaw crew and digging septic test holes.   Next I have to face the music from all the people who always don't like a rezoning. 

Dave2

Been there....Done that....best of luck with it, and I hope it all works out...rezoning meetings can quickly become nasty.  Don't forget that your likely-hood of success depends on how many townsfolk come out...next year is an election year, and the councillors will often play to the crowd to ensure votes...that doesn't mean you won't win at OMB, just cost you an awful lot more.   

I've actually had Councillors come to me afterwards to admit that they only voted against because of the voters in the audience...seen it happen many times...your little rezoning can quickly become a major election issue in a small town.  By deferring the matter to the OMB (by way of a denial), the local politicians keep their hands clean (where did I read about something like that in the bible)...all important in this is the recommendation of staff and commenting agencies, if they are on your side - then you will win in the end. 

[Dave2]

Been there....Done that....best of luck with it, and I hope it all works out...rezoning meetings can quickly become nasty.  Don't forget that your likely-hood of success depends on how many townsfolk come out...next year is an election year, and the councillors will often play to the crowd to ensure votes...that doesn't mean you won't win at OMB, just cost you an awful lot more.  

I've actually had Councillors come to me afterwards to admit that they only voted against because of the voters in the audience...seen it happen many times...your little rezoning can quickly become a major election issue in a small town.  By deferring the matter to the OMB (by way of a denial), the local politicians keep their hands clean (where did I read about something like that in the bible)...all important in this is the recommendation of staff and commenting agencies, if they are on your side - then you will win in the end.  

Thanks for encouragement.  In theory should be clean; all zoned rural; two are 2 acre lots and one is one acre lot.  Rezoning applications are for rural residential; but in 2 of the cases
won't be activated right away.  Septic pits were okay.  Explain strategy after council meeting in March.  Professional staff are generally okay but you never know with conservation authority.

My next problem is getting construction material to islands.  I am probably the only person on this board that wants a return of cold weather so I can use the ice.  Wierd thing is it might work in southern Ontario but in northern Ontario still is open water.  Go figure.

In one case I want material for a small storage outbuilding before new zoning standards come in. (New standards increase setback from water from 60' to 100')     In other I want to refurbish a cottage.

[DRD]

Hey Dave

Setbacks are exempt for a "pumphouse" and usually no size restrictions other than for a standard outbuilding. some towns do have bylaws if they have been through this.

[ErnestBidder]

Dave2:

  An Argo 8x8 with an Argo trailer, or even a float, would probably carry enough material for your storage building, if you can find one to rent/borrow. Any Argo dealers up that way?

  Glad to see the board active again.