Norfolt bidders, contact me to SAVE lots of MONEY !!!

[worldjohn]

On the 17 C Lane, Fishers Glen property ( the cottage near the lake)  there were two bidders.  The highest winning bid was over $60,000 and second place was mine at $20,000.    If the winner is here (or someone knows him) and you would like to buy my bid you could save a twenty thousand dollars. Or if you like, I would be willing to pay you to not continue with your purchase. 

[Mountainman]

I am Mountainman.

Would it not cost you at least $12,000 to have the high bidder step aside (20% of $60,000)? The high bidder would also probably want some profit. You would also have to pay the balance on your bid. If you are willing to pay this, why did you bid so low?

Mountainman has a question for the smart ones, what will occur if the high bidder agreed to step aside and the defaulter then paid the taxes? Would the deposit of the high bidder be lost?

[g2020]

Mountainman has a question for the smart ones, what will occur if the high bidder agreed to step aside and the defaulter then paid the taxes? Would the deposit of the high bidder be lost?

This is a question that probably only Frank can answer. Treasurer's discretion? Keep in mind that if you pay the taxes and you were not someone entitled to notification, then you would not likely receive a lien in priority to all others for the amount that you paid. The 60k person should have double bid. It is a rather simple algorithm to determine where to place your second bid. In this case it would have been more than 20k, by my calculation, so the 60k bidder would have been defaulting to himself. You should read some of the posts from Netpred about these high bids that may have been entered by an owner or creditor with priority at law - essentially a minimum bid. A true mountain man is a one of a kind individual who would only bid those properties that others ignore. A mountain man bid should be just over taxes, plus one cent. Happy hunting!

[worldjohn]

to mountain man asking why I bid so low.  I think the answer is fairly obvious. I would rather pay less than more.  I was hoping to be the only bidder and I almost was,  Had that one person not bid then I would have felt stupid paying so much more than I needed to. that is a feeling I want to avoid at all costs. I assume u are not the high bidder here, does anyone know who that high bidder is?

[Mountainman]

Mountainman has a question for the smart ones, what will occur if the high bidder agreed to step aside and the defaulter then paid the taxes? Would the deposit of the high bidder be lost?

This is a question that probably only Frank can answer. Treasurer's discretion? Keep in mind that if you pay the taxes and you were not someone entitled to notification, then you would not likely receive a lien in priority to all others for the amount that you paid. The 60k person should have double bid. It is a rather simple algorithm to determine where to place your second bid. In this case it would have been more than 20k, by my calculation, so the 60k bidder would have been defaulting to himself. You should read some of the posts from Netpred about these high bids that may have been entered by an owner or creditor with priority at law - essentially a minimum bid. A true mountain man is a one of a kind individual who would only bid those properties that others ignore. A mountain man bid should be just over taxes, plus one cent. Happy hunting!

I am Mountainman.

I have read so much here and Frank is the wisest by far. Frank, please tell me what will happen to the deposit of the high bidder when the delinquent one pays the taxes? Will the deposit be lost? If so, why would the higher one take the risk to please worldjohn.

I am Mountainman, but I am not stupid. I read everything here.

[ruok]

Highest tender loses his $12,000 deposit and pays Worldjohn $8,000 for his bid. Deed is prepared in the name or Company etc. as the highest tender chooses.
Worldjohn makes some cash and the highest tender pays $4o,ooo instead of $60,000.
James Township opening this week was similar. Highest tender was $32,579 and 2nd was $8,666

[ruok]

Sorry, I forgot to add that Mountainman is missing the point. The highest tender has an opportunity to save some money . His intent is not to please Worldjohn.
Worldjohn submitted a good tender. There is nothing wrong if he is able to help someone reduce their costs.

[g2020]

Worldjohn is seeking out the high bidder - good move. When I go to an opening I write down the names of every bidder in a ring bound book so that I have a history to use in situations like this. At some openings they will spell the names of every individual that bid, which can be valuable in future sales. Some municipalities such as Trent Hills and Sudbury post the names of every individual submitting a bid, on their website after the sale. I was not interested in Norfolk so I do not have the name of the high bidder, however, the treasurer just might surprise you by giving you the name, address, and phone number of the high bidder. The treasurer stands to gain a windfall 12k which his budget may appreciate. If someone sent me the name of the high bidder by private message I might just be able to get in touch with that individual. We do not like to post the names of individuals on this site. If the high bidder was a Corporation then the name is enough to do a corporate search and come up with an address and phone number.

[Mountainman]

I am Mountainman.

Mountainman does not miss the point. Mountainman read everything here carefully. The question that Mountainman has is not answered.

In this transaction, the first bidder must fail to deliver on the tender. The deposit is then gone to the collector. After the deposit is gone, the owner comes and pays to the collector. The sale is no longer and worldjohn does not own the lands, but so too is the deposit of the first bidder gone to the collector. The first bidder has lost the deposit, the owner has the lands, and wordjohn has the return of deposit.

I wait for the answer.

Thank you.

[ruok]

If the highest tender walks away he loses his deposit and Worldjohn is then contacted by the Municipality as the 2nd highest tender.

[Mountainman]

I am Mountainman.

I know this of what you speak. I read this and much more here.

I ask of what if owner delivers taxes to collector before worldjohn is new owner? Then collector keeps deposit of the high man, owner keeps property and worldjohn is returned deposit. If Mountainman is correct, why does high man take risk to lose everything to help worldjohn? That is my question. Please speak those who know the answer, but first know the question.

[g2020]

Mountainman, you may recall that Norfolk County had a tax sale on May 1 of this year and there was posting discussion regarding their procedure. Now that I think of it the discussion may have been mainly by private posts of senior members. At any rate only 2 properties were bid upon since the others were redeemed, some the day of the sale. Both of the properties bid upon were redeemed after the sale, so everyone wasted their time and money. Norfolk would not be able to keep the deposit because they inform owners that they will accept the cancellation amount following the sale, and they did in both cases at their first sale on May 1, 2013. You are a mountainman, think of the ramifications if mortgagees become aware that they can wait until after the sale to decide to redeem. Worldjohn is bidding like a true mountainman, with a low bid on a property that does not attract the crowds. Way to go Worldjohn. As mountainwoman Wendy stated "I like to steal them" - well said.

[Mountainman]

I am Mountainman.

You are one of the wise ones, but you still not know the question.

What of the problem when the owner pays the tax only after the high man has lost his money to the collector and before worldjohn makes quest to collector?

That is the question.

This is the answer.

The high man is now a poor man and a not happy man. The owner is the owner, and making fool of the high man. And worldjohn is returned deposit by collector. And the story happened because the high man was to help worldjohn.

Mountainman know about void and voidable. Mountainman not stupid. Sometimes Mountainman is high man.

Mountainman make visit with collector.

Mountainman happy.

Frank is wisest one. Frank knows of what Mountainman speaks.

[worldjohn]

I think I know what mountainman is talking about.  Firstly deals like this are dependent on people being honourable and trustworthy.  I have integrity and if a deal fell apart I would not keep the high bidders money.  Secondly if the owner redeems before the final payment is made by the bidder all deposits are returned. No one would lose. (this rarely happens anyways)  thirdly,  once the treasurer accepts the final payment the deal is done and the owner can no longer redeem the property (am I correct or can the owner redeem up until the deed is completed?).  I think there is very little risk but if the people involved in the deal don't trust each other they can always sign contracts.   
But if mountain man is talking about the period of time where the high bidder lets his deposit be taken and until the time second bidder pays,  well I would obviously arrange to make my payment the same or next day first thing in the morning so there is no chance for the owner to redeem in that small time period. (and how unlikely is that the owner would wait exactly two weeks after the tax sale to redeem.)  I think that covers mountain mans question. 

[Mountainman]

I am Mountainman.

You are wiser than appears. You know the question, but not the answer.

The collector awaits me.