Family Responsibility and Support and is a charge against the interest of land

[welcomelm]

Title search shows

Order under the Family Responsibility and Support and is a charge against the interest in the land. No value has been assigned in the document. To find out the amount of the interest, please contact the Family Responsibility Office.

What do I do to find out the how much is registered? I called FRO but they would not share that info with me.

[brigg]

Title search shows

Order under the Family Responsibility and Support and is a charge against the interest in the land. No value has been assigned in the document. To find out the amount of the interest, please contact the Family Responsibility Office.

What do I do to find out the how much is registered? I called FRO but they would not share that info with me.

Unfortunately I don't know how you would find the exact amount.  I would assume it would be a relatively small amount like under $20,000 or $30,000.  I think you go to jail or get your wages garnished if you get too far behind with FRO.  That is just my uneducated guess though as fortunately I have no experience in this field so that is a good question for a lawyer.

I would be curious to see if anyone on here has seen a FRO lien go higher than $30,000?  And if so how high was the largest you have seen?

[Frank]

Interesting....not sure you need to care about it. 

While on the surface this might look like a Crown lien, I am not sure it is and would ask for feedback from others on the board. 

The FRO itself is a crown agency, however the money's involved are not owing to the crown, they are amounts owing to a private individual and the FRO is empowered to collect it on their behalf pursuant to a court order. 

So....is this really a crown lien? 

[welcomelm]

OTA told me it is

[Matt]

The FRO itself is a crown agency, however the money's involved are not owing to the crown, they are amounts owing to a private individual and the FRO is empowered to collect it on their behalf pursuant to a court order.  

So....is this really a crown lien?  

First off, I believe it is a crown lien.  In fact, this type of crown lien has a higher priority. It has higher priority like liens by Revenue Canada for income tax evasion.

Here is my analogy.  Let's say a lady got divorced and the her former husband was ruled by the court to pay her $1,200 per month.  Now, he did not pay her at all or only a fraction of that amount.  Because of that, she was forced to apply and has been collecting $1,500 of monthly welfare payments from the government.  Government had to use public tax money to assist her and her children get going.

The government has thus the right and responsibility to collect the family payments with interest and penalty from the guy. FRO controls and executes the job.

Now, we can see why the husband can be placed behind the bars. Not paying for family support is more than the matter between husband and wife.  It is the matter between the public as a whole and a bad guy.

....

With respect to finding out the outstanding amount, it is not possible to do that unless you have a written consent from the guy or a court order to get that information. When you buy a house through a normal real estate sale and purchase transaction, getting such information is no problem.

In tax sales, there is no smooth or clear way of acquiring ANY Personal information.  This tells thousands of words.

[Matt]

Title search shows
 To find out the amount of the interest, please contact the Family Responsibility Office.

This sentence implies for normal real estate sales and purchase transactions where lawyers are involved at both ends and where the seller must sign a form to release personal information.

In tax sales, we are not getting any such information as the owner under distress will never sign such a form.

[welcomelm]

I am a little bit of confused by this case. Separation agreement (2008) asked husband to pay 650 per month since 2008, but the FRO lien was just registered on 2015, when the daughter is already 21. Can you believe how late it is. Also, the property was joint tenanted and the separated couple agreed to transferred the property to husband, who   is supposed to pay the wife about 32k it by the time of separation, which was 2008. I don't know if that payment happens, but at least the title search shows the property is still joint tenanted under both name, which means the transfer never happened.

[welcomelm]

And what is the highest FRO linen have you seen?

[Matt]

Welcomelm,

Hi,

Who would know the exact story, but we can process your given information and could suggest a probable story as follows.

1. He did not pay her 650 per month
2. He did not give her 32k for the house either.
3. So she would not sign the transfer of the house.
4. Therefore, everything remained status quo.
5. Over the seven years, government must have assisted her and her child with income tax returns and other benefits such as social welfare payments.
6. They did not pay the property taxes for a long time.
7. Municipality registered a tax lien.
8. FRO registered a crown lien.

If this story is real, I would feel so sorry for the wife as she could now lose the house because of the asshoxx.

However, I have heard that there are many frauds going on involving FRO.  Couples claim they are separated and receive all kinds of social benefits when they are in fact continue living together at the same place...  I am curious if this particular case is like one of them.

Avoid wild guesses and hearsay...
If I were you, I would try to calculate anticipated amount of the lien first, instead of looking for previous FRO lien amounts.  $650 x 12 months x 7 years; plus interest and penalties.  Once you have the anticipated amount, you will feel much more comfortable to make the best business decision.  Good luck!

[Pfm1011]

I would just run away, who needs the headaches of crown liens and dealing with people who cant be fired..pass

[Pfm1011]

The FRO itself is a crown agency, however the money's involved are not owing to the crown, they are amounts owing to a private individual and the FRO is empowered to collect it on their behalf pursuant to a court order. 
)

I believe they are rock solid  crown liens as the FRO pays your wife even if you don't pay and then guns for you. At all times the debtor writes the checks to the FRO.   The debt is not to the wife , it is to the FRO

( so I am told , despite all of her promises , my wife hasn't left me yet )

[Frank]

Thankfully I am not an expert on FRO dealings either.  I suspect however that support can continue past the ripe old age of 21 if the child is in attendance at college, etc....or if the child has a disability. 

This may indeed be a crown lien, but I frankly can't see why.  Payment is only made to the distressed party if they are on some sort of assistance, otherwise my understanding is  8)that the government doesn't put out if it doesn't collect from the deadbeat. 

[welcomelm]

Back from tender, I am the third. If not for the FRO, I would be the winner now On the other hand, the winner told us he wouldn't worry too much about the FRO. I am not sure if it is an experience talk or just sheer ignorance. Anyway, good luck with him.

[Pfm1011]

He may know something already and done some research and has a "well bought"   ..or he just blew his brains out

[Dave2]

He may know something already and done some research and has a "well bought"   ..or he just blew his brains out

In Kawartha Lakes some people who ignored crown liens now owe the Canada Revenue Agency 10 times what they paid for the property and 3 - 4 times the maximum value of the property.  Sad