Scugog

[Ion]

Has anyone looked into the Scugog properties?

[Jim19]

I went and looked into the propertoes. Ones a really nice 140 something acre, but with over 400k owed in a federal lein as well as whats owed to the town its a large investment.

The other acerage would be nice, too bad the owner plans on paying the taxes owed.

Another one is a garage in pretty rough shape, the lot is too small to build a home on i was told by the town. seems to be owned and used? by the home next door.

Interesed in details let me know

[Doozer]

Sale of the 95 acre property has been cancelled.  I heard there was a lot of interest in the lakefront property on Coulcliff (90 x 90).  Does anyone have any more information on it (i.e. town water/sewage/gas hook-up, building code restrictions, etc.)?

[Doozer]

So I went to Port Perry today and had a look at the 90x90 waterfront lot.  I spoke with a few neighbours and real estate agents and it appears that everyone knows about the sale.  Some of the neighbours across the street have hired a lawyer to try to block the sale.  Apparently, they will try to argue that the town does not have the authority to conduct the tax sale because of the prior use by the other residents of the space as a park and to access the lake.  I didn't really undertand the real estate agent's story but apparently the neighbours will argue that their prior use existed prior to the adoption of the land titles act and that they hold their interest under the surveyors act (sic?).  Something about the transfer from one act to the other not being effective for any prior use claims.

Bottom line is that it appears even if you get the lot, the neighbours will do everything in their power to stop you developing it.  Even if their position is not correct under the law it seems like they can make a lot of trouble for you.  Has anyone ever had any experience with irate neighbours?  Can they totally derail your deal? 

Funny enough, one of the neighbours is a real estate agent and said she might put in a bid despite her neighbours complaints.  Perhaps its just a case of circling the wagons!

[Rob]

In my opinion they cannot derail your deal.  There is clearly a tax sale property act put in place in 2001.  What they can do is hamper your efforts for a building permit in the future once you own the property. 

My guess is many of the neighbours will put in their own bid and once the property is sold with the deed in your hands, you will not hear from this noisy group again.  Every condo built in a desirable area of Toronto seems to have a similiar group of people protesting the end of the world that quickly disappears when a beautiful new building raises the property values of the area surrounding them.

[bee]

I checked this lot today, I can email you some pics no problm, just send me your email address . Also I think it's too sloppy? Isn't it?
Is there any way I can attach pictures here??

[JAM]

neighbours will argue that their prior use existed prior to the adoption of the land titles act and that they hold their interest under the surveyors act (sic?). Something about the transfer from one act to the other not being effective for any prior use claims.

Subdivision of the parcel was created 1921.  Owner retained this piece of property, didn't develop it and as such has been used for public recreation without issue with the owner.  Either that or neighbours directly behind the property are balking at the idea of losing their view and on a crusade to stake a tenuous claim.  I can only speak second hand but understand municipality lawyers have checked title on the matter and are satisfied no one in the street has a legal claim on the property in this way.  Neighbours will probably create problems if you buy and apply for variances when building, otherwise they have no rights.  They've just enjoyed a free lakeside picnic site or view till now.

Rob/Frank (anyone knowledgeable on the acts), are you familiar with the relationship between the land titles and surveyors acts and potential prior use claims like this?  Have you seen it revealed in prior sales?

Many Thanks

[bee]

Sounds like it's going to be a big battle over this lot Today... If anyone will be there please update us on bid amount$$.

Also if there is any fun stories, like blood spilled over this lot (just Kidding )?

Thanks Guys.

[Frank]

What I know about the legalities of rights of passage will probably not suffice.  However, under land titles you can only acquire this through a formal easment which is being granted and approved through the proper planning process. 

The previous rules allowed you to obtain either an encroachment by sitting on the land for a period of time and barring the real owner from using it for a specific length of time, the tests here are onerous and likely cannot be met, and in fact recent court cases have pretty much thrown out this concept.  However, you did have the ability to cross over a piece of property if you had done so for a length of time and were not hampered in doing so.  I wonder if any of the original tresspassors are still alive.  I don't believe it is a right you can pass along to a child or the whole neighbourhood. 

Any lawyer types out there want to offer their two cents, please do.

[Doozer]

Results of the tenders on the waterfront lot:  Highest bid: 182,429; 2nd highest: 152,000.  Number of bids: 29!

I guess people weren't scared off by the threats of litigation.  Interestingly, I understand that both the highest and second highest bids were from locals.  One of the real estate agents I spoke to on Monday was there and submitted the second highest bid.  She suggested that the FMV on the property was closer to 250,000.  Fascinating process.  I'm glad I bid even though I wasn't even close.

Another interesting aside.  I spoke with a couple of guys who were there to bid on the 143 acre property.  It was withdrawn about an hour before the auction so they didn't get a chance to submit their bid but apparently the 700k+ crown lien and the Greenbelt restrictions didn't scare them off (because they were "farmers" from "Pickering" and only intended to use the land for agricultural purposes).  Comments?

[bee]

Wow!!!! Thanks Doozer for update. This is really crazy.......... You can get waterfront cottage for just under 200 000$ on the same lake now. What people think when they buy for such price???

I guess this is good way to start selling properyes, not through MLS.


Thanks Again!